Communication and Understand: The 4 Languages of Temperament

[bookworm]

Hi,

I know it's been over a year since the posts at this topic. I didn't check back after a month or two, so I only saw many of them for the first time today. Thanks for all the feedback!

I just wanted to comment that my discussion of compliments was really (I hope) about communication and more specifically about acknowledgement, a huge part of any relationship. We should never take each other for granted and when we communicate specifically in the realm of acknowledgement, we are putting energy into the relationship - renewing it and deepening it.

In my defense, I view compliments as a primary way of acknowledging. (I know there are plenty of other ways, too) As for haircuts, it's just a little adventure into novelty. As those of you who are also ENTP well know, when you have taken on obligations which demand consistency, routine and focus on details, you just LOVE an opportunity to fling caution to the wind and make a change. The haircut itself is nothing. Communicating with my husband about my hair or about some other action which manifests my creativity and sense of style is just a way of connecting to him about something that's important to me.

I don't like passive aggressive behavior, so I wasn't trying to lure my husband in by fishing for a compliment, really. It's just that it seems so natural to me to find something to like about the status quo - any status quo. I just need to hear something that says, "I noticed your love of spontaneity and it's cool with me." You can see it's a little hurtful to get either of these responses: "I didn't notice your love of spontaneity" or "I noticed your love of spontaneity and it's not cool with me." If we (any married people) are not trying to know each other and find things to like about each other, that wouldn't be saying much about the relationship. And I think each partner can do his or her part to make it easier to know each other, and make the search for things to like about each other more direct and fulfilling. I THINK that's what I meant with my post.

So again, if you are ENTP (or close) working with ISFJ (or close) what can I say to communicate the above need? In reverse, the situation is that I, as an ENTP, can benefit from being reminded that not every conversation is about trying to get something explored and/or figured out.

Love KTT! I am using it to help me structure the thinking, behavior and speech of characters in a screenplay. It seems like an incredibly powerful way of harnessing insight about human personality.

[Olga]

Hello!

I don't know what you're looking for, but I can say something about compliments and then you can use whatever you want or ask more.

I usually don't give (spontaneous) compliments about looks, it happens only when the things people wear, or the looks they have, are TRULY pretty/beautiful/awesome. This goes for girls. I will spontaneously compliment a man if he is dressed neatly. Like a gentleman. Then I will point it pout to him.

If I do not do it spontaneously, then you look...ok. Regular. Nothing special. (people will be fine without too much flattering).

If you look horrible, I will not say so. Unless I know you very very well, and will be seen with you in public. I would want to avoid embarrasement. This is tricky however. I could say so to my last boyfriend, because we were so close. But I wouldn't want to hurt my friend's feelings, so I would probably swallow it. Or walk past it: "are you sure it's not too cold in that?" "You sure it fits where we're going?" "people will look at you...". It depends. I am usually not that picky about clothes, so this goes for extreme cases.

So, the problem you seem to have, is the "normal" part. How to change that...hm. In my opinion, if it's not spontaneous, it's not real. If you go on asking, the answer will be: it's fine. it's ok. it's cute. It's pretty. yeah..it looks good. But you know, that spontaneous spark will be missing...

How to say it is important to you?

When people tell me they felt good after I did something, or maybe they felt loved after I did something, (things of my own choice and right after the thing was done), I want to doo it again. So, if someone has a very nice dress, and I tell them that, and then they tell me that it made them feel good, then I will remember to do it more. (but not when it's plane normal).

It doesn't have to be right after a compliment though. People can communicate why giving compliments is a good thing, it is good because:

1. makes them feel good
2. makes them feel loved
3. makes them feel appreciated
4. makes them feel special
And so on...

Showing appreciation is also important (that you really do appreciate the compliments).

Note that you do not mention your need! And no shoulds (do not demand duty-I know my duty, do not point out to me my flaws (in case I have neglected my duty)). If people communicate what makes them feel better, it would be highly desirable to do it (one feels good about oneself after doing something good). Make him see that complimenting you is indeed a very good and honorable thing to do.

If this fails, then perhaps open communication is the way. I'm really not sure what it would include because I have never had one. But avoid blaming, scolding, shoulds/shouldn'ts, demands and perhaps need/want. Why I say perhaps about need/want is because this is a personal vendetta I have, and I am not sure if it can work or not.

And...don't forget to compliment him too! Do it about small things. My last boyfriend complimented me on my way of folding t-shirts. I was in heaven! It's the tiny things we want people to notice!

[Al3322]

Compliments are tricky. I think that Olga is correct in that it is necessary to explain how it makes you feel when you receive one.

Me, I don't receive critisism and some compliments well. I do not want some one saying something that is irrelevant, or shows that they do not understand what is going on, or that they just want to say something because they think that they should - or even worse, say something designed to manipulate you in some way. It is for this reason that I often will not give a comliment that I am not sure will be received correctly. This may be a fault and others probably do not see it the same. This is one reason that I enjoy reading this forum where the idealists often demonstate how to support people.

My idealist wife does know how to give compliments. She is very attuned to what is going on and she does not hesitate to say how much she appreciates it when she knows that something took some effort and consideration. She does not waste them and dilute the effect by trying to show that she has read a book or someone has counseled her to use them.

Also, I do not tend to notice things like haircuts and clothing changes. I mention it when I do. She does not seem to mind this and we joke about it occasionally. I do know that she is a person of action and will step in and get things organized and running while others are stuck in bureaucratic inertia. Other people sometimes resent her and think that she is bossy and overbearing, when she is trying to do good and help people. I make sure that I recognize the good she is doing and try to give her the support that is often lacking from her associates.

[Olga]

Al, I must say, you have a very calm and beautiful language. It sooths me, I don't know why. Very beautiful trait.

I have a question, if I believe you are saying irrelevant things, how should I communicate instead?

And, I have a tendency to say things just because, it means I want to keep talking to you because I like you, and not to annoy you

Just saying...

[Al3322]

This is very good Olga - begin with a compliment and then proceed with the subject. I think you are a very intelligent person who knows a lot about how to work with people.

By the way, your english is excellent. I know how difficult it is to have nuance in a language that is not your native. You do it very nicely. And, even if you did not, I a very used to working in different languages and understand the problems conveying the right tone.

In general, I (rationals?) have as our mission to understand things and to look at things in new ways. Because of this we have learned by education and experience that authority, no matter where it comes from, is often wrong, misguided or sometimes no longer useful. We do not respect anything just because someone says it or it has been done that way for a long time. In addition, to have this as a mission, we need our autonomy. We will protect that at all costs.

For these reasons, if you are in a position to have to change the behavior of a rational; or, heaven forbid, have one as a child, you need to know that to have a good effect, comments need to be precise with a how to change and a why.

This shows some respect in that we now can tell you why we do (say) what we do and we can change if we see that you are correct. We would rather be logical than defend a position that has been shown to be wrong. For example do not criticize attitude which is personal and instead point out what behavior that you want to change and why you want it changed. The why can be as simple as I would like it better if you would do xxx; but please give a reason.

Now, please tell me what you think is irrelevant and why you think so.

[Olga]

Thank you

You know, the irrational part was not about you, I was just wondering because I have used it myself. And 2 times on this board, 1st time with Lightningman-Mastermind, and recently with Sagatheist-Architect. So I wanted to know what to say instead in the future.

So..reasons. Ok. This could be problematic when I can't explain "why". Sometimes the "right" words do not exist

I don't think I have ever known any Rational. I might have met them, but nothing else developed. A coworker scored Mastermind and perhaps she is one. When I really got to know her our relationship worked very well. We disagreed once on "cheating", when I said that she and her boyfriend were cheating on each other by checking out other people. It frustrated her because they had an "agreement" about it being ok (do people realy make these agreements? I think not...). Anyway, we drifted apart a bit because of this, but eventually she started to "like" me again. We never brought it up after that one time. Now things are good, but I am not at that job right now since I have a semester of internship somewhere else. Hmm, do you think a Mastermind or another Rational would act like her, or could it be a different temperament?

[Al3322]

So..reasons. Ok. This could be problematic when I can't explain "why". Sometimes the "right" words do not exist

This is a problem when you feel something strongly but cannot explain it. However, understand that another person who does not feel it may not be willing to change their view because you said so. That should not stop you from saying how you feel.

Yes she could be a mastermind. The logic would fit perfectly in the aspect that she is open to questioning normal modes of behavior and at the same time insists on honesty in her personal relationship. I think that it is likely that she would not act on this since my experience with the rationals that I have known is that they are pretty much with one person until that relationship changes. An agreement like this may suit her and her partner perfectly, and even if one of them doesn't like it, it is at least honest.

[Olga]

Maybe Mastermind then...

When people have some sort of a problem with communication, it doesn't mean they have nothing valid to say. Perhaps the "listener" loses more...? A good point we would all do well to remember.

[Al3322]

Perhaps the "listener" loses more...? A good point we would all do well to remember

I sometimes have this conflict where on one hand I tell myself that I need to keep my opinions to myself to get along at work or in the community. On the other I should state my opinions since there may be people around who have the same ideas but think that no one else has them and therefore they are not valid. In addition, by keeping them to myself, I do not get feed back and lose the opportunity to rethink and maybe change those that are wrong.

Anyway, I agree in that its the listener that also loses.

[Olga]

I was thinking more...

Someone has a good idea and the "listener" is not humble enough to give someone room enough to express that idea (or rejects it...because he is not humble enough to consider it as valid/good). The idea cannot be communicated, and is lost to the unhumble "listener".